Krink Build Question - .223 or 5.45X39

If you could do only one, which would you do and what are the pros and cons?

I keep thinking the .223 would be safer due to ammo access? :doh:

All comments and suggestions appreciated.

I would go with 5.56, only because of ammo concerns.

Reasons to go with 5.45, it is a great round, mags are cheap and plentiful, and right now there is ammo. Not to mention it is authentic.

 

Any functionality issues with the .223? Also, I understand these Kmart Kits are new parts kits, not demills like the 5.45X39 Kits.

I have one Bulgy 5.54x39 Urbock underfolder Krink. But want a side folder. Picked up a beat up RR Norinco for a build.

Is it true that the .223 is in use by Bulgy Army now? Was told they moved away from the 5.45 round and went NATO?

Thanks for the comments

 

Yeah, I think Bulgaria went N.A.T.O. but can't swear to it off the top of my head. I haven't heard of any function issues with 5.56 krinks unless it was mag related. But if you stick with Bulgarian Waffles you will be fine. The 5.56 kits at K-Mart are new, and most of the 5.45 kits are de-milled rifles. A new parts kit is a little more involved as a build than a de-milled kit. So it is more work or more money if you have someone else do it. Both will rock

 

If I was in your shoes, I would go for 5.45x39mm.

The 5.45 is not going to disappear. Even without surplus, you still have wolf........last time I checked, most people who shoot AK's use Russian steel cased munitions like wolf, bear, tiger, etc. Go with 5.45.

Plus mags are very cheap. And if you ever get another 5.45mm AK, you can share mags. Can't do that with most 5.56mm AKs.

Go with the path of least resistance....the 5.45mm.

 

If I was in your shoes, I would go for 5.45x39mm.

The 5.45 is not going to disappear. Even without surplus, you still have wolf........last time I checked, most people who shoot AK's use Russian steel cased munitions like wolf, bear, tiger, etc. Go with 5.45.

Plus mags are very cheap. And if you ever get another 5.45mm AK, you can share mags. Can't do that with most 5.56mm AKs.

Go with the path of least resistance....the 5.45mm.

+1

Also, it's more correct for a real AK-74SU.

I HIGHLY doubt there will ever be a complete lack of 5.45X39... AND the 5.45 ammo will always be cheaper than 5.56.

 

If I was in your shoes, I would go for 5.45x39mm.

The 5.45 is not going to disappear. Even without surplus, you still have wolf........last time I checked, most people who shoot AK's use Russian steel cased munitions like wolf, bear, tiger, etc. Go with 5.45.

Plus mags are very cheap. And if you ever get another 5.45mm AK, you can share mags. Can't do that with most 5.56mm AKs.

Go with the path of least resistance....the 5.45mm.

+1

Also, it's more correct for a real AK-74SU.

I HIGHLY doubt there will ever be a complete lack of 5.45X39... AND the 5.45 ammo will always be cheaper than 5.56.

Big +1

Think of it this way. For $2500 you can have a 5.45 Krink and 10,000 rnds of mil-surp ammo. 10,000 rnds of 5.56 milsurp will run you that or more.

 

http://akforum.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=15196

 

Thanks for all the input. The comments actually reminded me that I had a Norinco in .223 and I had both feed and extraction issues.

I just sold a SAM-5 shot it maybe 200 rds with no issues. I sold it to fund ths build.

From everybodys comments it also reminded me that I just saw 2,100 rounds of surplus 5.45x39 for $300 and the last 1000 rounds of .223 cost me $300.

So I am cool with the ammo situation and the 5.54 as being easier build as it is a demill and not a new parts kit.

Question on over heating with the 5.45 round. I have been told that the Krink in 5.45 over heats easily even in short shooting sessions?? Any comments on this? Also-hand guards- should I go with the K-mart plastic with the steal heat sheild or the wood?

Can't wait for the build - I think it's going to In Range. :dance: :dance:

Thanks a Million.

 

ALL krinks can overheat, it's the nature of the beast.

 

5.56 does not work so well against squishy targets at less than 2,700 feet per second, but I suspect 5.45 may not perform dramatically better. With 5.56 out of an M4 with a 14.5 inch barrel, you will not maintain 2,700 fps past 40-100 meters, depending on bullet selection. What's a krink barrel, 8 inches? Out of a krink, performance will be dismal.

I really don't think a krink is a good weapon for social occasions. They are fun, but not so practical.

 

I am building a K-Var .223 Krink kit now. I can tell you it's quite a bit more difficult than a 5.45 demil build. The front trunnions have to be opened up about 50 1/1000 to accept the barrel. The trunnion ruined 2 very large and very expensive cobalt drill bits with out being drilled. It is slow going compaired to the demil plug and play kits. There are some pluses though. You dont have to drill out any rivets. Hummm........I guess that's the only one.

 

5.56 does not work so well against squishy targets at less than 2,700 feet per second, but I suspect 5.45 may not perform dramatically better. With 5.56 out of an M4 with a 14.5 inch barrel, you will not maintain 2,700 fps past 40-100 meters, depending on bullet selection. What's a krink barrel, 8 inches? Out of a krink, performance will be dismal.

I really don't think a krink is a good weapon for social occasions. They are fun, but not so practical.

I heartilly disagree.

5.45X39mm M73 Soviet does NOT derive it's power from speed, but rather, from hydraulics. Further, AK-74SU is NOT an assault rifle, it is meant to be treated as a submachine gun, that had the added benifit of working, acting, functioning just as thier assault rifle, meaning there wouldn't be further taining needed.

The abrrel was not some aritrary ength, but rather, was a length specifically chosen to give the round a vel performance equel the old 7.62 round.

Plenty of dead Muja thanks to krinks, as well as the 5.45 round itself. For urban warfare [generally 100 yards and under] the krink is an excellant weapon. If you're shooting past 100 yards, you don;t need a sub-gun... so you should have standard AK-74.

With that explained... what exactly did your diatrive bear in relation to which caliber he should choose, since you effectively said "neither they all suck"?

 

I have studied the 5.45 vs 5.56 question and the reason there are no 5.56 AKs for me (leaving aside Galil, Sig 556, etc) is case length. That action is optomized for 39mm casing. If that changes, like in the Siaga shotguns (much longer cases) the Ruskies shorten things up to account for the added length. I think that unless you have a "ground up" build for a 45mm case length you are inviting problems. Blame the mag, blame whatever, but accounting for an extra 6mm is a lot to think about in a weapon action.

 

I was going to move a head with the 5.45 build, and have researched the wound effects somewhat. It does appear that if not using steel core ammo, the 5.45 uses the dynamics of hydraulics, using a hollow space in front of a lead core. It is stable in flight but will yaw quickly when it hits squishie stuff, but there may not be fragmentation, but a sideways 5.45 round looks like it would do the type of damage early 5.56 AR-15 and ammo did when first deployed in Vietnam.

Is anybody building 7.62X39 Krinks? Sure would kick like heck, but more punch. Decisions Decisions..:doh:

 

Yes, you can get a Yugo M92 7.62X39mm "krink".

 

5.56 baby!
walmart ammo

 

I have shot several Bulgi 7.62 Krinks and they do not kick bad at all. I even built a 7.62 Bulgi Krink pistol and it was a pleasure to shoot. TC pistols in 7.62 kick A LOT harder.

 

OK, on the M92 kits / builds, are there any gotcha or problem areas to be aware of?

This build can be done on a Norinco registered receiver without any problems?

Any negatives on the 7,62 build -vs- a Bulgi 5.45 build?

Thanks for all the input, it is appreciated. :thumbsup:

 

5.45X39mm M73 Soviet does NOT derive it's power from speed, but rather, from hydraulics.

Velocity is a very important component of terminal ballistics. Without velocity, bullets don't hurt anyone. If you double the weight of a bullet (at a given velocity), you double the energy. If you double the velocity, you quadruple the energy. Velocity is where it's at.

If by 'hydraulics' you mean the lead core shifting within the bullet (causing destabilisation/tumbling), THAT is the mechanism the designers of the round provided to enhance it's wounding capability. Fackler (you know, the Dr. Martin one..) says tumbling is not the hot setup for hurting people, for a variety of reasons. With the velocity of a 5.45 krink somewhere near an AKM, with much less bullet mass, unless gnomes run out of the bushes and beat your target up, you're not going to equal the performance of the full sized 7.62x39 round.

I don't get what you mean by 'hydraulics'. Can you give some references so I can learn more?

The abrrel was not some aritrary ength, but rather, was a length specifically chosen to give the round a vel performance equel the old 7.62 round.

Really.

For urban warfare [generally 100 yards and under] the krink is an excellant weapon. If you're shooting past 100 yards, you don;t need a sub-gun... so you should have standard AK-74.

I agree that more is better... but there is more to being an 'excellent weapon for urban warfare' than terminal ballistics. The sight radius is too short, it gets crazy hot during periods of sustained fire (hard to hold on to without getting burned), and it's got crazy muzzle blast, which is fun when you're firing from an enclosed area like you might find in an urban combat environment. A full size AK of either flavor would be better.

With that explained... what exactly did your diatrive bear in relation to which caliber he should choose, since you effectively said "neither they all suck"?

Buy it because it's a cool icon of the former Soviet Union. Buy it because it makes you giggle. Buy it because you will enjoy it. But whatever you do, don't buy it because it's got great terminal ballistics, because it doesn't.

 

Doubling the velocity is a lot more effective for terminal ballistics than doubling the weight, but it is a hell of a lot easier to double the weight of a round than to double the velocity!