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Discussion Starter #1
If one wanted to refinish a Saiga with Rust-Oleum Appliance Epoxy, could they do it over the standard Saiga finish? Like, what exact finish do they use? I've read that it's parkerized with black paint on top. Is that true? Any help would be appreciated. Thanks! ;)
 

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I would media blast the old finish off. Applying paint over paint is usually a no-no. If you take a gun to go get cerakoted they sand blast the old finish off so that the new paint adheres to the surface.
 

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they don't parkerize.
they use phosphating primer or something that resembles it.
then paint over it. if you look at saiga rear sight you will see that sight leaf has different gray-ish coating than the rest of the rifle. It somewhat resembles park. well, that's it what's under the paint. they call it VL-02 primer. they actually use it on a lot of things. that stuff is generic for all things steel and not specific to firearms. it can be sprayed on or brushed on and it drys and/or cures within 30min and paint sprayed on right after that w/o any additional steps in-between.

something else i can divulge to all of you trying to replicate AK paint. it is not epoxy based like most paints here. it does not use charcoal black or bone-black as a pigment, like most coatings do here in US. that is why ir is so hard to replicate color and luster of true AK paint. ingredients used in many of paints are just wrong (read 'not same').
 

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they don't parkerize.
they use phosphating primer or something that resembles it.
then paint over it. if you look at saiga rear sight you will see that sight leaf has different gray-ish coating than the rest of the rifle. It somewhat resembles park. well, that's it what's under the paint. they call it VL-02 primer. they actually use it on a lot of things. that stuff is generic for all things steel and not specific to firearms. it can be sprayed on or brushed on and it drys and/or cures within 30min and paint sprayed on right after that w/o any additional steps in-between.

something else i can divulge to all of you trying to replicate AK paint. it is not epoxy based like most paints here. it does not use charcoal black or bone-black as a pigment, like most coatings do here in US. that is why ir is so hard to replicate color and luster of true AK paint. ingredients used in many of paints are just wrong (read 'not same').
Thanks for that. I always thought it was just some sort of typical phosphating, but I did notice it's a lighter grey than most I've seen. As most of us have seen, many of the commbloc finishes were an ultra dark violet/purple akin to ink as opposed to true black.
 

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Saigas are ZINC phosphated then painted with an alcohol based paint, strip the paint with denatured alcohol leaving the zinc phosphat alone then paint over that. Gray parts like the sight leaf are unpainted zinc phosphate not a paint or primer paint !
 

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I did a quick search earlier and the only zinc phosphate I found was green or yellow which sucks. I didn't search as thoroughly as I could though.
 

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I did a quick search earlier and the only zinc phosphate I found was green or yellow which sucks. I didn't search as thoroughly as I could though.
Zinc phosphate is applied in a hot bath like parkerizing, it is a type of parking, not a paint like zinc chromate ( aircraft structure paint ) !
 

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VL-02 is not something you can get your hands on here in US. I know for a fact IT IS a some sort of phosphating solution. because i've seen it used and prepared. it is definitely no hot tank application. it's super thin. not at all like hot phosphating which is thick compared to VL-02 primer. it is not used in the same fashion as regular hot phosphating. it is economical and quick way to condition and prep clean metal surface for best paint adhesion. it creates etched-like surface that paint has much easier time adhering to.

primer itself is prepared by mixing primer base and phosphoric acid in 4:1 ratio. then you let it sit for at least half an hour and then coat with it. it has shelf life of up to 12 month after mixing after which is no longer any good. you can dry it in the oven at 200c for about 15 minutes and after than you can apply next layer of primer or paint. VL-02 is actually yellowish-green liquid.

I was personally under impression that KG K-Phos is it. it looks the same, application instructions are the same and finished coat looks the same. i personally was gonna go with it instead of hot-phosphating just because its a lot less involved and also because i sold my tanks couple of years ago, lol.

what stuff did you see? where did you see it and what it's called?
 

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So... should I still strip the paint regardless?
you should if you want a quality looking finish.

don't blast with glass beads. use alumina oxide
if you 'etch' with something like k-phos or even hot-park it. you are adding another layer of protection. which is strictly speaking not required but recommended. depends how much work you want to put into refinish of your gun.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
The only problem is that I've never done any of this before and I don't have the money to get it professionally redone. Would you recommend me do this myself or save it for the professionals?
 

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how much money do you have to invest into refinishing? i don't know what your number is but $150 can get you entire rifle cerakoted. which i personally think is a superior finish compared to most other options.

if you are really tight for funs then simply keep existing izhmash paint and only coat areas needing finish with appliance epoxy. it might not looks like 100% match but underside is usually not visible at the same time as side of the receiver.
from what i understand all you want is a protective coating and not necessarily a 'correct' looks. if true then go cheapest way with a can of rustoleum.

technically you CAN spray paint over izhmash paint. it' very thin coat. just rought up the surface with fine sand-paper and degrease with acetone. but i'd suggest the not to do that and just coat exposed areas alone.

good luck
 
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