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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am doing a few Soviet builds right now and had some questions so i know what pairings would be totally correct/timeline specific.

First, what timeframe did the change from 4.5 to 5.5mm folding stock axis pins take place? then after this change, when did the modern polymer 5.5mm stock appear? Were the triangle 5.5mm stocks ever used on the regular AKS-74 or just AK-74m guns before the switch to polymer?

Also, when was the switch from Laminate to Plum polymer? Then when did the plum turn to true black? Is a true black Russian handguard and pistol grip setup with 5.5mm triangle stock correct for say a 1991-1993 AKS-74?

Last question relates to the bayonet. At what timeframes did the old first pattern AKM bayo get replaced by the second pattern? I have a 1969 AKM and was curious what bayo is correct for it?

Then when did the second pattern get replaced by the modern third pattern bayo on the 74's?

What years would two rivet bullet guides be correct, and when did the switch to the turning rivet take place?

So far i am building my 1992 AKS-74 with two rivet bullet guide, true black furnature, True black magazine, and 5.5mm triangle folder, with third gen bayo. Is this correct?


I am trying to un-blur the lines between the late AK-74's, AK-74m and 100 series components for three builds, in addition to build my 1969 Izzy AKM correctly.


In all i will be doing a 1992 AKS-74, 1988 AKS-74, 1993 bulgy AKS-74, and 1969 izzy AKM


And lastly, what about the "clover leaf" trigger guards? -Thanks guys.
 

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I'll try to help answer some of your questions if I can.

First, what timeframe did the change from 4.5 to 5.5mm folding stock axis pins take place?


1990-'91

then after this change, when did the modern polymer 5.5mm stock appear?

The stocks changed before the pins changed.

Were the triangle 5.5mm stocks ever used on the regular AKS-74 or just AK-74m guns before the switch to polymer?

The 5.5mm pin triangle folder does not fit into the mainstream military AKS-74/AK-74M timeline, and came out after the polymer folders were introduced and adopted. In military terms, the metal 5.5mm pin stock is basically meant to be a retro-fit or custom order item for rifles that were originally issued with polymer stocks.

Also, when was the switch from Laminate to Plum polymer?

Late 1985- early '86 was the transitional period

Then when did the plum turn to true black?

1990-early '91, with some transitional mixing involved

Is a true black Russian handguard and pistol grip setup with 5.5mm triangle stock correct for say a 1991-1993 AKS-74?

It appears from documented examples that they stopped making AKS-74's for the military in 1991. A 1992 example could certainly be totally possible, so i would not change what you are doing (and it's a cool project!), just keep in mind that the military had adopted the AK-74M by 1992 so they were probably not accepting rifles with the triangle stocks after that point. Especially considering it was during the Russian Economic Depression. That does not in any way mean they did not exist, but from 1990-92 almost no new procurements were being made unless they were under more or less emergency conditions .

I'm sure Izhmash would have built some AKS-74 rifles using 5.5mm folders combined with black plastic if they were special ordered. Most likely, if you were somebody like a Saudi Sultan, and had tried to special order AKS-74's in 1992-93, you might have received older AKS-74 from inventory stock, or new production AK-74M's since I'm not quite sure if they even had a 5.5,mm metal stock until a short while later. The first time I saw it's use was on mid-90's versions of Bizon SMG's. Maybe they did have them in 1992, but also realize the receiver for a 4.5mm stock is different than the one for a 5.5mm stock, with a different angle on the back. The new trunnion won't fit in the old receiver properly.

The 5.5mm pin triangle stocks got popular later on in the late '90's, mostly on paramilitary and new modles of civilian market military styled Saiga rifles, and eventually many outlets were selling them as spare parts. The factory kept getting requests for them, and i guess that's why you see so many of them now. They are not, however, correct for a Russian military AKS-74.

Last question relates to the bayonet. At what timeframes did the old first pattern AKM bayo get replaced by the second pattern? I have a 1969 AKM and was curious what bayo is correct for it?


The 1968 AKM training poster shows the type 2 bayonet, which is one of the first dated materials to illustrate one. For a 1969 Izhmash rifle, I think you could go either way on the bayonet as it takes a while for new types to get into mainstream issue. If it's a Tula rifle, I bet they were still only issuing Type 1's as they were historically slower to change over to new patterns. I prefer to use the Type 1 with a 1969 rifle, since it's more of an old school styling, but somebody more experienced in AKM bayonets might be able to answer your question more fully.

Then when did the second pattern get replaced by the modern third pattern bayo on the 74's?


The first ones were issue din 1983-84.

What years would two rivet bullet guides be correct,

1986-87 onwards

and when did the switch to the turning rivet take place?

They started using them off and on in about 1990, mostly on some batches of AK-100's and Saiga's, but not military AK-74M's. It was not until about 1997-98 that you saw them on just about all models to include standard military AK-74M's.
 

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Great thread. Great knowledge Tantal.

I have a Soviet timeline question:
When did they transition from wood pistol grips to bakelite on RPKs?

Thank You!
 
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IMO all Soviet RPK's had laminated wood pistol grips from the factory as new, right up until they stopped making them in 1976.
 

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IMO all Soviet RPK's had laminated wood pistol grips from the factory as new, right up until they stopped making them in 1976.
Boom! Headshot. Thank You.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Thanks.

So, a two rivet bullet guide would have been used from 1987 to 1998, and true black furnature started being used in 1990. leaving a 1991 rifle with a two rivet bullet guide, true black furnature, and a 4.5mm triangle folder.

A 1992 would be the same true black, double bullet guide or potentially turn rivet, and a 5.5mm polymer folder.

Last question to get my build correct, what was the latest style triangle stock? Mine is the smooth, non rolled edge, with no ridges on the buttplate, with a rear trunion that has no mold numbers at all unlike the later bulgarians. Did the soviets ever have the mold numbers in the regular bulgy location?
May you help me with a timeline for the folders? As in rolled edge, ridged butt, and non...?

And when did the soviets start using the "Clover Leaf" stamped trigger guards?

Thanks very much for the info.
 

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So, a two rivet bullet guide would have been used from 1987 to 1998, and true black furnature started being used in 1990. leaving a 1991 rifle with a two rivet bullet guide, true black furnature, and a 4.5mm triangle folder.

Trye black furniture was introduced by 1991 but they used a lot of plum furniture on military rifles that year, somtimes mixed with black. I guess they were trying to get rid of it all so they could start using the new stuff on the new rifle being introduced that year year.

A 1992 would be the same true black, double bullet guide or potentially turn rivet, and a 5.5mm polymer folder.


Yes, I think they would be right.

Last question to get my build correct, what was the latest style triangle stock?

From late 1978 to 1991 they used the same basic stock on the AKS-74. In 1978 it did not have drain holes, and in 1982 the lip for the catch hook got less distinctively shaped, but otherwise it was the same stock with non-rolled struts and no ribs on the buttplate.

Mine is the smooth, non rolled edge, with no ridges on the buttplate, with a rear trunion that has no mold numbers at all unlike the later bulgarians. Did the soviets ever have the mold numbers in the regular bulgy location?

Izhevsk trunnions usually had X/X format mold numbers on the inside flat face, back in the Soviet days, up until the change to 5.5mm trunnions. There might be some late ones without mold numbers, but I had a 1989-dated rifle with them. However, I don't think the 5.5mm trunnions normally do.

May you help me with a timeline for the folders? As in rolled edge, ridged butt, and non...?

The rolled strut, ribbed buttplate folding stock was a Tula design used on the 1982-1993 AKSU. There are at least 6 distinct types of Izhmash AKS-74 4.5mm triangle buttstocks, many of which are not interchangeable due to the folder angle changing three times. That does not include the AK-74M polymer styles (early 4.5 and standard 5.5mm versions), or the late 5,5mm metal version we talked about before. You'll have to read the book to learn more, hehe.

And when did the Soviets start using the "Clover Leaf" stamped trigger guards?

In late 1986 the left side of the trigger guard mag catch housing lip was notched in a sort of clover-leaf pattern. The stop plate was left straight with no notch. This is the way military rifles were left until at least the very late 90's or very early 2000's. .

I hope that help, guys.
 

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Bump great info.
 

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What compensator is correct for an AK74 with plum furniture?
As wingnut308 pointed out, here's an original example of the correct late 80's smooth collar two-piece from an '88 kit:

 
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