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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am building a couple (3) Russian PLO capture kits into rifles. I wanted to know what you guys thoughts were as far as the receiver serial matching the kit. Is this THAT big of a deal from a value standpoint? I have a limited time to build these things and Nodak has a 6 week wait on the custom serials, then they need to go to POHF to be engraved, and somebody else to be parked before I get a hold of them.

What dollar value am I losing by not having the serial match?

Thanks :D

-Ryan
 

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Opinion

It is definitely worth getting the matching numbers. If you don't, you might regret it later, especially with Russian kits.
 

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It really does not matter if the receiver has the same serial number that is on the trunion.

Now some folks may think it is, but no matter how you slice it, it's still a parts kit built on a US receiver.
 

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I'm in agreement with Caligula..... but, being that it doesn't cost anymore to get a custom serial number from NDS, you might as well if you think that not having a matching number would bother you.
 

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Tapeo1 said:
I'm in agreement with Caligula..... but, being that it doesn't cost anymore to get a custom serial number from NDS, you might as well if you think that not having a matching number would bother you.
+1 Russia never had serial numbers on their Receivers..some had proof marks. I would say since it is free service from NDS you should do it. By getting the custom serial numbers on your reciever it sure won't hurt the value/resale of your rifle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
The problem is the time :D I have to wait 6 weeks + the time it takes mario to engrave them and then they have to be blasted and parked before they get back to me, talking 3 months probably. If i Go std serials, I can cut that to a month or month and half at most :D

-Ryan
 

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Personally I don't like my receiver S/N to match the parts kit. If I ever decide to take apart my rifle I don't want any upsetment about "removing the serial number" when I pull the trunnion. It's sad we home builders have to think like that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
You guys convinced me, I am ordering the receivers tomorrow :D Hopefully mario can squeeze me in :D

-Ryan
 

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SteveM said:
Personally I don't like my receiver S/N to match the parts kit. If I ever decide to take apart my rifle I don't want any upsetment about "removing the serial number" when I pull the trunnion. It's sad we home builders have to think like that.
Why would you care what others think and why would it matter? The receiver was 4473'd to you with the S/N on the receiver and not the trunnion. Would not matter if it was split. Baby Jesus only cried once when the original kit was demilled the first time.

Hootbro
 

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Hootbro said:
Baby Jesus only cried once when the original kit was demilled the first time.
Hootbro
I had to smile at that one.
 

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Hootbro said:
Why would you care what others think and why would it matter? The receiver was 4473'd to you with the S/N on the receiver and not the trunnion. Would not matter if it was split. Baby Jesus only cried once when the original kit was demilled the first time.

Hootbro
Now imagine explaining that to your local ATF agent who is investigating your "arms cache" of more guns than one person needs. Then imagine you are at trial with the US Attorney showing a jury a SLR-105 with S/N on the trunnion. Now imagine your expensive attorney trying to explain why it was OK for you to take a similar trunnion off of your receiver when it had the serial number on it.

Is it paranoia? Maybe, but why chance it for some obsession with matching numbers on a part that was never supposed to be numbered.
 

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SteveM said:
Now imagine explaining that to your local ATF agent who is investigating your "arms cache" of more guns than one person needs. Then imagine you are at trial with the US Attorney showing a jury a SLR-105 with S/N on the trunnion. Now imagine your expensive attorney trying to explain why it was OK for you to take a similar trunnion off of your receiver when it had the serial number on it.

Is it paranoia? Maybe, but why chance it for some obsession with matching numbers on a part that was never supposed to be numbered.
'


Apples and oranges.

Unless I am missing something, the original poster was talking about kit builds on American receivers. You are talking about a imported rifle (SLR-105) .
 

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Hootbro said:
Apples and oranges.

Unless I am missing something, the original poster was talking about kit builds on American receivers. You are talking about a imported rifle (SLR-105) .
Apples and Oranges to you Mr. AKForum Technical Advisor, but to a jury of your "peers" (and average ATF guy) the American and imported receivers are the same.

"Mr Hootbro, is serial number 123456 the serial number of your receiver as written on the 4473?"

"Mr Hootbro, is the number engraved on this piece 123456?

"Mr. Hootbro, did you remove this piece from your receiver?"

"I rest my case."

Yes, I know...preposterous isn't it? But why even take the chance for a "feel good" matching number?
 

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SteveM said:
Apples and Oranges to you Mr. AKForum Technical Advisor, but to a jury of your "peers" (and average ATF guy) the American and imported receivers are the same.

"Mr Hootbro, is serial number 123456 the serial number of your receiver as written on the 4473?"

"Mr Hootbro, is the number engraved on this piece 123456?

"Mr. Hootbro, did you remove this piece from your receiver?"

"I rest my case."

Yes, I know...preposterous isn't it? But why even take the chance for a "feel good" matching number?
Whatever Steve.

Unless you can quote a precedent, I stand by my statements. The ATF would have to prove that the U.S. receiver left the factory with a serialized trunnion installed and was the controlling S/N.

I do not deal in speculation.

Thanks for accentuating my adviser title. Reminded me to update my work resume with that info.:neutral:

Hootbro
 

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Hootbro I didn't mean to sound sarcastic about your title, I was being serious about 99.999% of the population not being able to tell the difference as compared to someone like you.

Unless you can quote a precedent, I stand by my statements. The ATF would have to prove that the U.S. receiver left the factory with a serialized trunnion installed and was the controlling S/N.
Who wants to become the precedent? And unfortunately, ATF (aka "Always Think Forfeiture") doesn't have to prove anything to take your guns and ruin your day with an expensive legal battle to reclaim them. My point is why give them an excuse just for an "aftermarket" matching number.

Just the way I think. I understand what you are saying too. :smile:
 

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SteveM said:
Hootbro I didn't mean to sound sarcastic about your title, I was being serious about 99.999% of the population not being able to tell the difference as compared to someone like you.

Unless you can quote a precedent, I stand by my statements. The ATF would have to prove that the U.S. receiver left the factory with a serialized trunnion installed and was the controlling S/N.
Who wants to become the precedent? And unfortunately, ATF (aka "Always Think Forfeiture") doesn't have to prove anything to take your guns and ruin your day with an expensive legal battle to reclaim them. My point is why give them an excuse just for an "aftermarket" matching number.

Just the way I think. I understand what you are saying too. :smile:
Well we can agree to never underestimate the stupidity of the ATF. :goof:
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
SteveM said:
Hootbro I didn't mean to sound sarcastic about your title, I was being serious about 99.999% of the population not being able to tell the difference as compared to someone like you.

Unless you can quote a precedent, I stand by my statements. The ATF would have to prove that the U.S. receiver left the factory with a serialized trunnion installed and was the controlling S/N.
Who wants to become the precedent? And unfortunately, ATF (aka "Always Think Forfeiture") doesn't have to prove anything to take your guns and ruin your day with an expensive legal battle to reclaim them. My point is why give them an excuse just for an "aftermarket" matching number.

Just the way I think. I understand what you are saying too. :smile:
Man, Hootbro is absolutely right, it would take about 5 minutes to confirm with NDS that the receiver left the factory w/ a certain serial, and no trunnion.

Furthermore, many big name AK smiths have engraved the original trunnion S/N into the receiver, and then removed the trunnion.

You are way off base with this comparison and I don't think your scenario would have any bearing on a persons decision for or against custom serials ;)

-Ryan
 

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CatalystX said:
Man, Hootbro is absolutely right, it would take about 5 minutes to confirm with NDS that the receiver left the factory w/ a certain serial, and no trunnion.
Who is going to do that? An ATF agent intent on seizing your (alleged) machinegun parts?

Furthermore, many big name AK smiths have engraved the original trunnion S/N into the receiver, and then removed the trunnion.
True, but you won't find one who will admit they do this without a special variance letter from ATF.

You are way off base with this comparison and I don't think your scenario would have any bearing on a persons decision for or against custom serials ;)

-Ryan
Don't shoot the messenger when you are the one who asked for advice. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
SteveM said:
CatalystX said:
Man, Hootbro is absolutely right, it would take about 5 minutes to confirm with NDS that the receiver left the factory w/ a certain serial, and no trunnion.
Who is going to do that? An ATF agent intent on seizing your (alleged) machinegun parts?
I still dont see the connection here. Unless the ATF agent brought a drill for your 3rd pin hole, I dont see how they could seize it as a machinegun part.

I wasnt trying to shoot the messenger, I just dont know how we got here from what I asked lol.

-Ryan
 
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