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Discussion Starter #1
I have always wondered this question, i am not trying to get any info on how to break into one, but rather how easy it is for someone to break into mine! I bought a high end top of line Liberty recently, wasnt cheap, despite the sale, with electric lock. But found out that despite a UL listing, it is not considered a safe, but rather a consumer container? And it is tested to resist for 5-10 min. to someone with average tools!
I have heard people saying they could be cut wide open with a band-saw, as well as with a torch??
From what i hear the really good ones are beyond the avg. persons reach, due to price, at least ones that are considered by UL to be a safe, rather than a consumer container! I belive the UL listing for a real safe is at least 1 hr. compared to 5-10 min. for a cont. which most of us have!
thank you! SCARED! :roll: :shock:
 

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I've always lived by this philosophy:

NOTHING is foolproof.
If they want in badly enough, they will find a way.
Don't make it easy for them: don't have a cutting torch and gases in your garage for them to use.
The only thieves you are really going to stop are the "grab and go" type that just needs another hit of crack. A professional thief is probably going to laugh at anything other than utter, complete concealment (i.e. he doesn't even know where to look).

Just like a "bulletproof" vest is really only "bullet resistant", your safe is not "burglar proof", just "burglar resistant."

Still, it's better than nothing and it will stop maybe the majority of thieves who are in a hurry, don't have the equipment to crack it, etc.


I'm sure people with more knowledge than me can recommend a really top-of-the-line safe to you, but keep in mind, for every immovable object there is an irresistable force.
 

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These things are just thick sheet steel. A torch will make short work of them and damage contents. I have seen guys on YouTube bust them open in ten minutes with long prybars. But they had the advantage of having the safe out on the floor with room to work on it and swing them large prybars. I have read reports of safes being dragged from houses by trucks with long cables.
A determined and creative bastard will get into it just about no matter what it is.

I think it's best to keep it bolted to the wall and floor in a small closet where easy access and room to work is a problem for wannbe thieves.
 

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As stated above, make it hard to work on. Bolt it down and stack heavy stuff on top, they may get in but they'll have to work for it. :wink:

BTW, a small explosive device wired to the door is also a plus :twisted:
 

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check out www.sturdysafe.com

He builds some features into his safes that commercial consumer "safe" companies do not. I also like his little article on what "fire rating" really means.

When we buy our house, I am getting on of these....

-C
 

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Discussion Starter #6
JOHNO said:
As stated above, make it hard to work on. Bolt it down and stack heavy stuff on top, they may get in but they'll have to work for it. :wink:

BTW, a small explosive device wired to the door is also a plus :twisted:
:lol: I thought of that, but am concerned it would go off onme! :roll: :lol:
But am thinking of a devise i have seen for yrs. dont remember the name
but if door is opened, and unit is not de-act. in a few seconds it will fill the house with pepper spray!
I do have it bolted and in a corner, where it is imposs. to work on it, except from one side!
I think the spray unit will be all-right, since now whenever i open it, i have to cautiously open only 10 inches and dis-connect the wire to the hand-grenade! :lol: :twisted:
 

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I think the pepper spray stuff your talking about is called Bulldog 2000. I may be wrong but I used to see it advertised in the shotgun news.
 

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Your gun safe as well as commercial money safes are basically rated for the amount of time it takes to get into them with a specific type of entry method.

Look at it this way - even the gold repository at Fort Knox can be had with the right tools and force - it's the getting all that there and having the dwell time that increases the risk.

With your safe, you are buying five to ten minutes of additional risk that someone could be caught in your home trying to get the thing open. Add additional overlapping layers of security - alarms, cameras, OC spray intrusion devices, dogs - increases the professional hazard to the thief.

So, in summary, the guys above are right - anything can be had, you are forcing bad guy to increase his risk with additional time on target, think of defense as layered.
 

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JOHNO said:
As stated above, make it hard to work on. Bolt it down and stack heavy stuff on top, they may get in but they'll have to work for it. :wink:

BTW, a small explosive device wired to the door is also a plus :twisted:
Or just some creepy looking wires, some soap, and a motion detector hooked to a timer!



On a side note...It seems like alot of the safe MFRs are on the west coast. I would presume they import them there. Are there any Southeast importers/mfrs where we could save some coin on freight?
 

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how about a decoy safe and a real one that's hidden?

you could put some mildly valuable stuff in the decoy. it IS still a safe. but anything you really wanted to protect put elsewhere. they hit the one, they probably won't bother looking for another.
 

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JOHNO said:
BTW, a small explosive device wired to the door is also a plus :twisted:
2-3 Lbs of 2Fg Black powder velcroed to the inside of
the door at the hinge points should do the trick... :twisted:

KyAKGuy
 

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When I have my own house built down the line- again, IF I can, then when...


I will have a basement safe. An entire room built with thick pumped concrete on the floor and all sides with a steel skeleton to include the ceiling. Something underground and with a heavy, disguised door with several heavy locking bolts. Basically, something that is damn near impossible to get into and hopefully will double as a shelter during storms.


Then a decoy semi-expensive safe upstairs filled with rocks and a post it note that informs any potential robber how happy I am that he gave the cops that much more time to show up. And to be a real asshole, yes, I'll make sure there is a Bulldog 2000 unit inside of it with a delay just long enough for him to see the note.


Expensive and a long, long, long ways away... but certainly worth it. :grin:
 

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99.9% of the common thieves will be intimidated enough by the sight of a safe not to even try it....The other 1/10 will be professionals and have much bigger fish to fry than your gun collection...In fact they won't even be in you house to start with unless you are extremely wealthy.
 

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bolted to the floor corectly, with the opening side of the door against a wall, it makes it very hard for a thief to get any leverage when the wall is in the way... personally I build walls all the way around my safe and on the top.. so it really cant be tilted out.. make it hard for them to get to and it adds to the safety of the safe.. My safe is bolted to a wood sub-floor, with plate steal overlapping 2 floor truss's and the nuts and plate steel are welded together after installation..
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Thanks for all the great answers, i feel better now :roll: since it is bolted
and in a corner where there is only 2 feet wide open area on 1 side, so nobody can get any leverage to do anything! But i was wondering if the
electric lock could be opened if it gets knocked off the safe, but i heard elec. locks were harder to pick than manual! Thanks again! :grin:


PS. I had thought about putting a sticky note reminding me to dis-arm
the pepper-spray security device within a few seconds of opening the door. But decided against it, since if i ever would get broken in to, that
the burglar would leave me a Thank-You note stating that next time he will bring his gas-mask! :lol: :roflmao:
 

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Don't know how easy it would be to knock off an electric lock. I saw a show where some professional burglars would dust a button lock for prints and guess the combination. They did this in Marcinko's book "Red Cell" as well.

I wouldn't worry about something like that, cool trick though.
 

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Safe manufactuers used to fill the doors with chemicals ranging anywhere from primitive tear gas to things on the verge of mustard gas. So that if the door or lock was drilled the bad guys would be rendered harmless or dead.

Every now and then local FD's have to block off old parts of town because some idiot in a demo crew decided to try to break into a safe they were scapping.


However I want one of those sturdysafe.com safes if that girl will set it up and show me how it works.
 

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I have to agree with everyone else here on this one. My father always said "Locks are to keep honest people honest, anyone that wants it will get it."
Q-gunner2 said:
When I have my own house built down the line- again, IF I can, then when...


I will have a basement safe. An entire room built with thick pumped concrete on the floor and all sides with a steel skeleton to include the ceiling. Something underground and with a heavy, disguised door with several heavy locking bolts. Basically, something that is damn near impossible to get into and hopefully will double as a shelter during storms.
Q, the house I bought came with one. 18' x 26' with 12" steel reinforced concrete walls, floor and ceiling. Rooms about 8' under ground level and dry as bone. To boot if you dont walk all the way to the back of the laundry room, you never see the stairs going down to it. It's a work in progress toy room. :wink:
 
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