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Discussion Starter #1
After reading through Ekie's transitional primer I notice NO pictures of AK74's with wood (laminate) grips. Were they or were they not ever used early on??? Anyone?

TIA
 

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Yes they were.

Whether from the factory I don't know but I have plenty of pics showing early 74's ( with angled gas block ) shown with laminate grips being used in Afghanistan.

You can see 2 here (held and pointing torwards camera laying down) that both have laminated grips. One being held has angled gas block.



Also if you want to zoom in on receiver markings you see early 74s have the long skinny horizontol cut AKM style selector notches instead of the 74 short and angled cut selector notches.



Another laminated grip on a 90? gas block AKS-74



This is the reason I used a laminate grip on my 83 clone project.
 

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SturmGrenadier said:
Yes they were.

Whether from the factory I don't know but I have plenty of pics showing early 74's ( with angled gas block ) shown with laminate grips being used in Afghanistan.

You can see 2 here (held and pointing torwards camera laying down) that both have laminated grips. One being held has angled gas block.



Also if you want to zoom in on receiver markings you see early 74s have the long skinny horizontol cut AKM style selector notches instead of the 74 short and angled cut selector notches.



Another laminated grip on a 90? gas block AKS-74



This is the reason I used a laminate grip on my 83 clone project.
Those are AKS74, not full sized rifles.. Its well accepted that the AKS used wood pistol grips during the early years. The AKMS switched to a plum grip in 1977, sure the AKS74 was about the same time.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
All right!

DEBATE! :smile:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
That sling looks like it has the "pad" from an RPK sling (or IS an RPK sling?)?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Danke'uvel (sp?)

:wink:
 

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Kuiper said:
I remembered that I found this one Tantal's site once...

http://tantal.kalashnikov.guns.ru/pro9.html

This is an Izhmash AKS74, the handguards of the nonvented type and, suprise, a laminated pistol grip.

And a laminate grip on a fixed stock '84 AK74, also a select fire Izhevsk model...

http://tantal.kalashnikov.guns.ru/pro8.html
The rifles on their are both owned by a collector in Switzerland, and came via Bulgaria.. Sure they were modified at some point in time.. Still nice rifles though...
 

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Mnn..that would explain the laminate grip on the fixed stock rifle. The bulgarians used both AKM bakelite and laminate in a mix...

So here's the problem, what is a collectors grade 100% original. Where did it come from and who did what to it.

Seems to me, weapon customizing was a not done deal in the red army. So any laminate pg's on early eighties AKS's must either came from the factory or done by a batallion armorer as a repair job.

The pics Sturm has shown are all wartime pics, and that makes an AKS74 clone with laminate pg historically correct. Even if it is not factory original. The question that remains unanswered is; did they leave the factory with the grip.

And it also seems the latter is the problem to prove, that is. I can't find jackfaeces in my papers and literature.
 

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And yet we have seen numerous AKS74's, mostly wartime (Afghan '79-'80's) with laminate grips...especially in airborne units.

Now these can't all be refits....

There's a bit too many blanks that can't be filled with concrete information.
 

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Kuiper said:
And yet we have seen numerous AKS74's, mostly wartime (Afghan '79-'80's) with laminate grips...especially in airborne units.

Now these can't all be refits....

There's a bit too many blanks that can't be filled with concrete information.
I already mentioned that the AKSs left the factory with wood grips..AKMS changed to shiny plum in 1977; Figured the AKS74 would be the same time.
 

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Yes, you did mention that. But there's quite a bit gap between '77-'78 when the AKMS was definitely equipped with bakelite PG's and a several 81-84 AKS74's with laminate grips.


Now I don't know if a transitional period like that is normal for the Red army...seems like a long time to me.
 

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Kuiper said:
Yes, you did mention that. But there's quite a bit gap between '77-'78 when the AKMS was definitely equipped with bakelite PG's and a several 81-84 AKS74's with laminate grips.


Now I don't know if a transitional period like that is normal for the Red army...seems like a long time to me.
Sure there is a bit of a transitional period, but all the untouched AKS74s that I have seen from 1978-84 (end of wood) used a shiny plum grip.. Thats for a rifle either in military service or in a museum.. Basically untouched by a civilian collector.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
This is getting good................
 

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Having seen your photo's of the weapons you photographed how many AK's you've seen.

Yet, there's also photo's from wartime afghanistan late seventies/early eighties. One photograph is at least '84-'85 as the weapon already has a plum magazine.

Now I know the time into the war says nothing about the issued years of the weapons, but you would have to agree that if the consensus on these AKS's is bakelite grips from '77 onward these shots from the front are confusing to say the least... :confused:

@Tomovich, I like these discussions also. They are they same modelers have when building. And in fact dressing your bulgie or mine for that matter with historically correct DDR/soviet material is nothing less but modeling only the scale model is 1:1 and functional. :smile:
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I agree wholeheartedly and that's why I said it was interesting. Not because you guys were going to fight but because I was going to LEARN MORE. Since you guys are never out in my shop to ask questions of when I'm working on these things I have to come here!!!!!! :wink:

I have (13) 74 kits right now and one has been built into a correct DDR rifle and the rest are headed toward being Russian (and Bulgarian) from different time frames and I want them to be correct also. Thanks for the continued input.
 
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