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Discussion starter · #21 ·
Thanks for including the range finder info fearrains, I saw it in the other thread and was impressed. I'm glad you added it here too :beer:


Z
 
yea, fearrainsdown, thanks for the add!!

i dont think those are cheesy drawings, good visual indicators



here is the issue that i found with using 5, 45 and these scopes.

past 600 meters i had hellowa time hitting even a man size targets. I think its a combination of my shooting skills and the wind bouncing 7N6 around. Using Kashtan, and being within 500 meter range is a pretty safe bet of being able to make consistent hit on a man size targets. and the scope will allow you to do it all day long
This is one of the down-sides of 1P78 that also should be considered

The scope exhibits a light-bounce (sorry, ESL) from the anterior lens that can be seen at far distances by guys with long range optics. If you are sitting in ambush, your opponents can pick up on the light rays bouncing off the lens- this is common for most scopees. Now..Look at the construction of the PO 3,5x21. There is a large rubber pad that is protecting the lens and hides it from the same phenomenon
 
yeah! i hope someone found the pics useful..

please explain the light bounce issue a little more.. i guess im confused. does the rubber eyepiece do anything to shield this effect? are you talking about light shining in thru the exit lense and reflecting off the anterior lense and back out?

speaking of the rubber eyepiece, this is my only one complaint with either the PO3.5x21 and the kashtan. don't get me wrong, i love the feel of the rubber eyepice myself. and to my surprise it's totally useable for me even tho i wear eyeglasses. my complaint is, what am i gonna do if i ever tear or damage it?
i wrote kalinka to ask if replacements could be had, at least for the kashtan, but i received no response.
 
p.s. i know this isnt exactly the right tread to ask this but i have TX and voron here together at once. i have been keeping up with your guys' testing and reviews of these scopes. also voron's testing of the hornady 5.45 ammo. my question for you guys is:

in the "long range" testing you guys have been doing with these scopes, have you used any hornady 5.45 or strictly 7N6?

if so, have you noticed much of a shift in POA vs POI between the 7N6 and the Hornady out at these 400M and greater distances?

i read in one thread that there was no noiceable shift out to 100M,
but 4,5,and 600M might be a different story.

those of us with no access to long shooting ranges are dying to know
 
fearrainsdown said:
yeah! i hope someone found the pics useful..

please explain the light bounce issue a little more.. i guess im confused. does the rubber eyepiece do anything to shield this effect? are you talking about light shining in thru the exit lense and reflecting off the anterior lense and back out?

speaking of the rubber eyepiece, this is my only one complaint with either the PO3.5x21 and the kashtan. don't get me wrong, i love the feel of the rubber eyepice myself. and to my surprise it's totally useable for me even tho i wear eyeglasses. my complaint is, what am i gonna do if i ever tear or damage it?
i wrote kalinka to ask if replacements could be had, at least for the kashtan, but i received no response.
sorry, i should have been a little more clear

as Zen pointed out to me, the effect is not solely exhibit to the Kashtan, but to any scope that does not have a protective anterior end piece. Take the PSO-1 or PSO-1M2...the end has an extended piece that slides over and protects the scope not only from the rain, but from light bouncing off the anterior lens.

but it IS a sniper scope, which Kashtan is not by any means. Kashtan leaves PSO-1 in the dust when it comes down to the field of view and tritium filled illuminated reticle.

PO 3,5x21 has a rubber extention on it, protecting the anterior lense. But look at the downsize of the PO 3,5x21....it has doubled the weight of Kashtan, and 1/3 of the size

we are NOT taking about sniper type scope that I should have been more clear of. Kashtan is an quick acquisition scope that was made for AK-74 assault rifle to be fired on select fire, not sitting in a brush billy zane and tom berenger style. my bad
 
Discussion starter · #26 ·
I'm currently limited to about 300m but might get a chance to shoot at a 1000 yard range up in Austin, TX with my friend Nictra. We need to coordinate the details but it might happen this summer.

Also haven't had a chance to fool with Hornady but I'll get around to it soon I think, I'm a 7N6 man to the core but Voron's review was really great and I'd like to see some first hand.



Z
 
if you ever make it out there, some feedback of your results would definitely be appreciated. id love to sight mine in using 7n6, unfortunately the only range i have reasonable access to does not allow FMJ ammo so hornady the alternative
 
i;ll write up a quick review for you later
for now, just read the gunns and ammo article in the ammunition section, its a good start
 
Any ideas of how the tritium element is put into these scopes? It would be nice if we could replace it after it goes dead.
 
Discussion starter · #30 ·
I can't see anything externally like the 1P29 or 1P76 for example, so it has to be by disassembling the scope body itself. Seems like it will be a factory replacement (unless I am missing something)



Z
 
I would like to chime in with a possible deficiency with the 1P78 and see what y'all think. Today ran through a couple hundred rounds at some bowling pins and paper targets, full sun red clay backdrop optic is perfect. I could not ask for a better optic for this rifle. This evening with the sun beyond the mountain (low light/nearly dusk) foliage backdrop(trees, bushes etc..) the retical absolutely blends in with the foliage could not take a shot. It appears to me that with the low light conditions the scope is doing what it is designed to do, that is make the retical visible via illumination with tritium which would have been perfect if the backdrop was any other color but green. Has anyone else had any similar experiences? The target was a Coyote just inside the treeline, fully visible through both the 1P78 and the Nightforce on my Rem 700 problem is the retical disappeared on the Kashtan.
 
Thats an interesting observation, but I'm still waiting on mine. I was actually surprised to hear the Russians went with green tritium instead of red. Green is brighter, but red is better for keeping your night vision.

I'm interested to hear what others think about this as well.
 
Finally got my Kashtan, and was able to zero it yesterday. The initial adjustments were off, so I had to move to about 40M to get a group on paper, then go from there.
Once I got the adjustments right, it zeroed well at 100M, and according to voron, this method is the one to use to attain your 400M BZO.
Next time out, I plan on using a center mass hold, then engaging targets at 100, 200, and 300M to see where the shots go. The ammo I used is Polish 7N6, and it seems to do quite well.


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The method I used was to draw a 44CM circle on the target, then at 100M using a rest, and using the TOP chevron in the reticle at the BOTTOM of the circle, fired then adjusted the groups untill they were in the middle of the circle.
I really love this scope, and I'm happy with the results so far. :smile:
 
nice man! i am waiting for mine now. I got the RPK version. Since the buttstock is slightly shorter, the base of the scope sits little more anterior.

as soon as i get it- range report!
 
voron said:
nice man! i am waiting for mine now. I got the RPK version. Since the buttstock is slightly shorter, the base of the scope sits little more anterior.

as soon as i get it- range report!
wow! there is a place that offers models other than "AK-74"?
which place are you getting that RPK model from? Do you know if the can get other models like 7.62 AKM version?
 
I ordered a Kashtan from kalinka but what I got is a different model?

The reticule consists of just one chevron.



I don't own a camera so I used my cellphone, I couldn't get a decent picture of the reticule. I dont understand Russian so the manual is not much help. Any idea what I have here?
 
Well, it says on the side: you have a Kashtan S-1. It's for Saigas with pistol grip and military-type buttstock (as opposed to hunting stock, which is the S-2 - Probably has to do with eye relief, I imagine).

Basically the civilian version of the 1P78 Kashtan, like how the Saigas come with a civilian rear sight.
 
I think Ill keep it and use it on my AK-105. Seeing how the original version was meant for a 16 in barrel AK74, I guess that this would be ideal for a 12.5 in barrel AK?
 
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