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A world without oil?

1K views 15 replies 9 participants last post by  red_metallic 
#1 ·
Any ideas what the world would be like without oil? I don't think things will dry up just like that, but I would be interested to know what you guys think.

Horses, bicycles, steam power, alternate fuels created? I am thinking there would be a a mix of the above. Maybe even go back to the steam train and steam boat for distribution of food and materials.
 
#5 ·
Being a professional heavy truck mechanic, i see alot of the new transportation technology coming down the pipeline and tend to have a pretty good feel for where certain markets are going.

Next 20-30 years you will see hydrogren power eventually replacing current gasoline powered passenger cars and probably light trucks. You may see a full on hydrogen production vehicle as early as 2015. I believe, however, that diesel will remain the primary power source for larger vehicles for some time. That said, I think its no far stretch to say that even the heavy industry will eventually goto hydrogen. One example that im rather impresed by (and im no ford man, either), is fords latest foray into hydrogen. They have a 6.8 v10, similar to the current model trucks. Only this one can run on E85, Gasoline, or hydrogen. Running on gas or e85, the motor develops around 325 ponies and something like 430ftlbs of torque...quite standard. However, switch to hydrogen, and a purpose built supercharger is used. While running off hydrogen and with the aid of the supercharger, the big v10 is only making around 230 horsepower. Still quite good. And hydrogen is outrageously plentiful.

You can fully believe that oil will serve as a HUGE factor in the coming years on this planet. While we arent in nearly as bad of shape as many like to believe, its not an infinite resource by any means.

Anything past that, All i could see is perhaps some sort of a "micro fusion cell" of some sort.
 
#6 ·
Planet Earth has at least a 1,000 year supply of oil and gas even at current rates of increasing consumption.

All it takes is the right price, the oil is there.

For instance, the USA sits on top of the world's largest oil reserves.

Shale oil. All it takes is the right price to tap it. It'w extremely hard to extract and therefore expensive. But, there is more oil there than what has been used to DATE.

Also, oil fields are never depleted below 50%. Same problem, difficulty in extraction.

There is not and will not be an oil shortage for hundreds and hundreds of years.

Supply disruptions and shortages yes. Depletion, no.
 
#7 ·
We won't run out of oil for quite some time.

As is stands now it still costs more to produce hydrogen than gasoline.
Compare what 1 gallon of gas costs compared to a gallon of water or milk ( and keep in mind milk is subsidized by the US gov't). We still get a good deal on gasoline compared to other countries.

The hydrogen dream is just that. Far too many problems arise from that "solution".
Good read I've saved on the subject http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=581

S70 is right on the money. The Earth has so many energy sources we've only begun to tap them. Now we just need to up the efficiency of the engines and machine processes we use to fully utilize every precious amount of energy used.
 
#8 ·
Aw, I already started hooking horsed up to my car and trying to make a generator that runs off pig waste, like in Mad Max 3. Anyways good to hear what other people think on the subject. I don't think something like this would happen overnight either, but it is an interesting subject to me.
 
#9 ·
Good link, jake. that was a decent read. I dont particularly agree with all points brought up, but i did learn a few things.

Like the earlier days of computers, hydrogen technology is just barely taking off. While it currently has a larger price of production then gasoline/diesel, the technology applied to this particular field only really recently started in the last 15 years or so to any great effect. Gasoline and diesel powered engines took some time to take off as well. As more and more people are getting involved you will start seeing it leak into the mainstream more and more and prices will come down. The hydrogen market is just beginning.
 
#10 ·
Yeah but comparing computer or gasoline to hydrogen is like comparing apples to monkeys.

We don't dig through layers of Earth and refine hydrogen it has to be man made. That process is what costs more money, energy, and for all the global warming activists out there more CO2 emissions when compared to Oil refinement at any production level.

Think that we would also have to revamp the entire US infrastructure to accommodate hydrogen vehicles. That alone would cost well over into the billions and that's with the hydrogen car working or not at this point.
Also the dirty secret of hydrogen is the only way we can produce it today in the quantities needed as we speak of in this thread in order to take the place of gasoline/diesel is by use of fossil fuels coal and oil.

You trade fossil fuels coming out of your tail pipe for fossil fuels coming out of the factory that makes your hydrogen.

We will never in our life time see the US or any other modernized country like the US weened off of Oil. It won't happen. Hydrogen will never be mass produced because of it's nature to produce it.

The only way to use less would be:

-More Reliable, Efficient, and Cheap public transportations
-Cars and Trucks which can get better gas mileage
-Better Engine Efficiency levels
-Engines that utilize more than 1 form of fuel ,or a mixture.
 
#11 ·
im not saying its necessarily a better power source...quite the contrary, it has a lower energy content then gasoline. Believe me, I love stomping the stupid pedal in my 1 ton pickup with a 427 i built.

Merely saying that hydrogen is coming into play. There are some fuel stations that supply hydrogen...but they are extremely far and few. Think of bio-diesel and e85 when it first came around, to an even lesser extent.

Not trying to arge, but as it is we have seen a few multi fueld vehicles (the ford superduty for one) and had some seminars based around hydrogen power and multi fuel engines in general. It may not come into play until later then my prediction of 20 years or so, but it is coming.
 
#12 ·
OK, I took you out of context then sorry Conklin.

Mixed energy/fuel vehicles are on the way. I personally don't think it will be hydrogen. More of a case where cars run on stored electrical cells in standard city stop and go driving and utilize gas or diesel for long highway driving or for pulling/towing loads.
 
#13 ·
Now we just need to up the efficiency of the engines and machine processes we use to fully utilize every precious amount of energy used.
Most modern internal combustion engines are operating near their Carnot efficiencies(the highest efficiency possible). Or did you mean efficiency in terms of gas mileage, because those can be 2 very different measurements of efficiency.
 
#14 ·
NMBigfoot02 said:
Now we just need to up the efficiency of the engines and machine processes we use to fully utilize every precious amount of energy used.
Most modern internal combustion engines are operating near their Carnot efficiencies(the highest efficiency possible). Or did you mean efficiency in terms of gas mileage, because those can be 2 very different measurements of efficiency.
Ideally both. But maybe some bright individual will come along with some improvement on the Carnot efficiency level. I'm not holding my breath but it would be a huge leap in the way we use energy.
 
#15 ·
Well, gas mileage could be increased across the board for almost all vehicles, but really the only solution to making IC engine powered vehicles more fuel efficient would be to decrease their displacement. This is the main reason that hybrid vehicles get such good gas mileage. I think hybrids are a step in the right direction, but still doesn't remove oil from the equation completely. As for improving the Carnot efficiency of an engine, you're very right not to hold your breath, because you'd be dead long before we see that day. :wink:
 
#16 ·
First & foremost, we could meet our electric generation needs with new nuclear plants and we would never need to build another coal or hydro plant. Further, coal can be liquified and fuel produced from it. It is more expensive than basing it from oil as we do now but if no oil were available it would be a pragmatic way to go. Coal is something the US does not appear to have a short supply on. This in addition to more economical vehicles, higher efficiency energy usage such as LED home lights, and solar power additions to every US home. Oil would be missed but I totally reject the Mad Max scenario of our world grinding to a halt due to the lack of it. Humans are far too adaptable & clever. This year I reduced my fuel expense by $450 per month by getting rid of my gas pig. We aren't even scratching the surface of efficiency & conservation if someone like me can make that big of a difference by really doing nothing special.
 
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